the only good poet
One retreat after another without peace.
Jesus FUCKING CHRIST. That's a name we haven't seen in a while. Well said.
The senseless, tragic rape of Charles Bukowski’s ghost by John Martin’s Black Sparrow Press
- Thread starter mjp
- Start date
mjp
Founding member
It would be a violation of copyright.
Having said that, you may notice that Martin no longer edits the new collections from Ecco, Abel Debritto does. That is due to Linda Bukowski being made aware of the changes that we're talking about. She was unhappy to learn about it, and you won't ever see another collection edited by Martin.
Also, someone has taken it upon themselves to do collections based on the manuscripts. You can find links to those in the timeline. They're actually quite well done and they're also inexpensive, so you might want to check those out.
Brother Schenker
Founding member
Right on, MJP!
That is great news about Linda finding out and actually giving a damn and putting a stop to Martin's mentally ill bullshit actions. You were no doubt instrumental in sounding the alarm and hopefully it will lead eventually to new editions restored to their unmolested original contents. Thank you for making a stink about it. Rape was an appropriate word for what Martin did---I mean, really, if you think about it, he did the equivalent of a Cosby-Rape, y'know? Waiting until Buk was physically incapable of defending his body of work against Martin's heinous assaults...whatta fucken dick.
I will check out that link. Cheers.
That is great news about Linda finding out and actually giving a damn and putting a stop to Martin's mentally ill bullshit actions. You were no doubt instrumental in sounding the alarm and hopefully it will lead eventually to new editions restored to their unmolested original contents. Thank you for making a stink about it. Rape was an appropriate word for what Martin did---I mean, really, if you think about it, he did the equivalent of a Cosby-Rape, y'know? Waiting until Buk was physically incapable of defending his body of work against Martin's heinous assaults...whatta fucken dick.
I will check out that link. Cheers.
mjp
Founding member
In all fairness, a few people here have brought up changes, it isn't just me, and we've been talking about them since 2006. We started doing side by side comparisons in 2010.
There's also this: http://bukowski.net/comparisons/ There are only 25 or so there, but there could be hundreds.
There's also this: http://bukowski.net/comparisons/ There are only 25 or so there, but there could be hundreds.
Pogue Mahone
Officials say drugs may have played a part
From Howard Sounes, Locked in the Arms of a Crazy Life (pages 223-224):
The method of editing The Last Night of the Earth Poems was the same as with all the other books published by Black Sparrow. He gave John Martin carte blanche to choose what he wanted to publish. “He didn’t even know what I was going to put in and then he never went back to look at his early work so he didn’t what I left out. He didn’t care,” says John Martin…
The method of editing The Last Night of the Earth Poems was the same as with all the other books published by Black Sparrow. He gave John Martin carte blanche to choose what he wanted to publish. “He didn’t even know what I was going to put in and then he never went back to look at his early work so he didn’t what I left out. He didn’t care,” says John Martin…
I step out for a smoke that lasts three months like that guy in Summer School who's zipper got stuck, I come back and holy cow! Real Change has happened when I was gone. Just when I thought good things only happen in fairy tales and Knut Hamsun novels.
You all are indeed fucking awesome.
So I finally finished an article on John Martin’s unforgivably sloppy editing of Bukowski’s posthumous poetry collections. One national paper showed interest in the article, but didn’t take it in the end. So it finally ended up in the student mag for the department of literature at the University of Bergen. (http://prosopopeia.no/index.html) That’s actually a good thing. Many of Norway’s university teachers will read it and many of the students at that department as well, students that will end up working in the major publishing houses and high schools here in Norway. So anyway, I hope the article will make Bukowski readers in Norway wary of the butchered books.
In the article, I concentrate on being as objective as possible. I use the poem “Escape” as an example of JM’s sloppy editing. This poem was chosen because it appeared in Prism International, a mag that some readers in Norway may know and that is easy to check up.
Funny thing: One of the editors commenting on the article was named Jon Martin. That’s his first name. But still, kind of spooky. He also is a former student of mine (in high school). So now he got his revenge getting to correct/edit my writing. So it goes. ;-)
There are a lot of references to BUKOWSKI.NET in the article, so hopefully you might be getting some look ups from Norway in the weeks to come MJP.
I also give a cryptic hint to the bootlegs in the article. Those are beautiful books!
If anyone wants to read the article in Norwegian just say the word and I’ll e-mail it to you or something like that…
PS: I can translate the title for you. It goes something like this: "Bukowski's posthumous poetry collections are not what you think they are."
In the article, I concentrate on being as objective as possible. I use the poem “Escape” as an example of JM’s sloppy editing. This poem was chosen because it appeared in Prism International, a mag that some readers in Norway may know and that is easy to check up.
Funny thing: One of the editors commenting on the article was named Jon Martin. That’s his first name. But still, kind of spooky. He also is a former student of mine (in high school). So now he got his revenge getting to correct/edit my writing. So it goes. ;-)
There are a lot of references to BUKOWSKI.NET in the article, so hopefully you might be getting some look ups from Norway in the weeks to come MJP.
I also give a cryptic hint to the bootlegs in the article. Those are beautiful books!
If anyone wants to read the article in Norwegian just say the word and I’ll e-mail it to you or something like that…
PS: I can translate the title for you. It goes something like this: "Bukowski's posthumous poetry collections are not what you think they are."
I'd
Buk mentioned a magazine that used to publish his poems as he sent them (ie. with hash marks included where he had made mistakes). I wish poetry books written by him did this, as well as whatever the magazine was that did it.
I get quite a few views on my website pages about the Martin "editing". Most from Germany and the rest mainly from N. America and Europe. I think the word is getting out there, slowly. Abel's new books are also - delicately - suggesting the posthumous editions are not what they should be and as these enter libraries and circulation that will make clear what the problems have been.
mjp
Founding member
That's where the Bukowski interest lies in general, so it's not surprising. Sometimes it seems like half of the Google+ and Twitter followers are from Spain or Turkey...
When I first noticed these changes (first brought to my attention while listening to Bukowski reading his own work and following the text of that work in a Black Sparrow book I had) I've got a feeling what John Martin may have been trying to do is to 'tame' down the language in Bukowski's writing, removing the expletives, so that he could get Black Sparrow books onto reading lists for schools, colleges, etc. This is just a feeling of course and he didn't answer my question directly when I asked this of him so many years ago. He sent me some Black Sparrow merchandising instead (which was a kind thing to do but didn't really interest me so much as getting a straight answer to my question).
PhillyDave
“The essential doesn't change.” Beckett
BSP stuff? Kind of kind but not kind what he did to Buk's work, not by a long shot.
"In the decades since Bukowski's passing, the esteem and respect of Martin's peers and supporters continues to grow"
Martin is in a rage. Living with all that money begotten from his cash cow that up and died.
Martin is in a rage. Living with all that money begotten from his cash cow that up and died.
Black Swan
Abord the Yorikke!
edited a few days ago by an anonymous user. By the tone of it, definitely wouldn't be our mjp but I do wonder who! o_0o
Mmmm....maybe rhymes with Trollinax.
Pogue Mahone
Officials say drugs may have played a part
There a couple of Bukowski items in an auction a few months back and this was once of them. (There were also some manuscripts I will send to MJP)
The letter is to Hank Malone (not Marvin).
Big Cred to the original Bukowski "scholars" from this forum who helped prevent what Bukowski feared...
The letter is to Hank Malone (not Marvin).
Big Cred to the original Bukowski "scholars" from this forum who helped prevent what Bukowski feared...
Black Swan
Abord the Yorikke!
Oh! He was not happy with the changes.
the additions nullify the flow......
The Scarlet is pretty much left alone but the rest of it is creamed. :mad:
the additions nullify the flow......
The Scarlet is pretty much left alone but the rest of it is creamed. :mad:
A dim glimmer of hope could be the day, if ever, Library of America compiles Buk's poems like they recently did with Kerouac and publishes a 'collected poems' edition. A caring editor would then match the poems, not to a previous publication, but to the corrected typescript from the author.
PhillyDave
“The essential doesn't change.” Beckett
The work has begun. Check the manuscripts section too. Essential Bukowski: Poetry edited by Abel Debritto is out there.
I'll do my part. I'm going to take my new copy of Sifting Through the Madness for the Word, the Line, the Way and match it to the manuscripts and mark up my copy, make a video for Amazon review and physically show the extent of the changes so that people will be less inclined to buy it. Publishers notice that kind of thing ..
mjp
Founding member
thanks
I'm surprised there aren't any comments addressing this at Amazon.
I'm surprised there aren't any comments addressing this at Amazon.
PhillyDave
“The essential doesn't change.” Beckett
I feel flattered.
(in a positive way that is)
PhillyDave
“The essential doesn't change.” Beckett
It's good and real and all in the quest to find and experience honest art
for fuck's sake, why in the world do they (or he) need to dick with a man's life's work . . . ?
Pogue Mahone
Officials say drugs may have played a part
Philly Dave is a rather good looking specimen.