Charles Bukowski & Georgia Hubbard

[mjp]

Bill, you seem like an ok guy and your request for my identity is easy enough. With no disrespect to most of the posters here, I feel dirty just being apart of this thread.

Last time I checked, participation was voluntary.

mjp has diarrhea of the mouth and is ever so eager to share his misinformation with anyone who doesn't notice his court jester hat

Feel free to contradict any misinformation. We will all listen closely for the cricket-sound of your non-response.

Oh, that's right, you are under a Supreme Court gag order so you can't discuss it. I forgot.

and identify him as the criminal clown he is. I say criminal because instead of asking me who I am in an honorable way like Bill, he illegally violates my privacy by going into private forum information. Very felonious and indicative of a lack of integrity, morals, and honor.

If there was criminal activity, I suggest calling the police! It sounds important, and they are there to help.

Wait, I see that you are claiming that a felony was perpetrated against you. Scratch the police part. You need to call the FBI! Right now!

What's up with the moderators around here. Not very smart.

Charmer.

My name is Geoff Levine and Joan is my mother.

As predicted, no crystal ball required.

I try and stay out of the bull shit rumors and misinformation because it's really none of my business.

Good job.

But

Gah, there's always a "but."

I felt I had to defend my mother from the felonious clowns lies and disrespect. The real question should be, "Who is this clown, mjp, and what is his relationship to Ulvis?".

Well, you caught me. I am Ulvis Alberts' ex-step nephew (through marriage and subsequent divorce). I have never met my ex-step uncle, but I was forced to choose sides in this horribly imprortant legal gag order skirmish, so I had to come down on the side of ex-family. You understand.

Bill, I hope that I have been honorable and polite enough to identify myself when asked.

Yes, it only took a year from the first time someone suggested you introduce yourself. An honorable year for you, what with all your achievements and important work, but still, our patience has its limits.

Sorry for getting distracted by the class clown, but he seems to be better at pushing buttons than being funny.

Oh come on, you didn't even crack a smile at the "ex-step nephew" bit?

I do hope that some day the court records can be unsealed and, if not us, at least future generations can know the horrible truth of this indescribably important issue!

We must know who really took that fucking picture GEOFF!

I would beg you to disobey the Supreme Court gag order and give us the truth we so desperately crave, but I fear that my pleas would fall on deaf ears. You have to do what you have to do. You are an extremely cruel, yet honorable, man.

Just like your mother.

 

[james]

She has always given Ulvis Alberts credit and royalties from their partnership with that picture.

well, once again she claims to have taken the photos. no mention of ulvis at all. not even a whisper. when will the courts allow us to know the truth??? when, oh when dear lord?!?

 

[Billville]

Shit! I'm always late to the party. Just walking in the door I can see someone's taking themselves and their mother too seriously. Give him hell mjp, oh, and ah... maybe direct 'em over to the "what I'm having for drinking thread." (since he feels so dirty in this one) :D

 

[puravida2u]

Happy Black Friday. As a professional photographer myself since 1984, I have watched this string since nearly the beginning with great pleasure. It looked like throats were getting a little parched of late so I decided to finally step into the middle & wade around the anal ooze for awhile. My name is Gene Alberts, 48 y/o son of Ulvis Alberts. That's what it said on my birth-cert anyway---and all I knew---until finally proven when Ulvis and I met for the first time in 1987. So, hello to all, and, most importantly, a very special WTF greeting to Geoff! Man, do I have a story to tell! Unfortunately, I'm out of wine, the dog's gotta shit, and I'm hungry. But I promise you, this will all be cleared up by Christmas. Stay tuned. Should be fun!

 

[bospress.net]

Hi Gene;

Welcome. Ulvis is a great guy.

Bill

 

[puravida2u]

Thanks Bill! I love the courageous work you do. The clamshell preservation boxes are great! Yes, Ulvis is rare bird with some symptoms of the general de-evolution of humanity, but a true Master of the Photographic Art for more than four decades now. (www.ulvisalbertsphotographs.com). As the bastard son of an absentee father for 25 yrs, we've had our serious issues, but we press on together because there is little else.

So, now that my whistle be wetted, and tongue be sharp, lets fire a few warning rounds across the unholy bow of this ongoing delusion, shall we? Or, to quote our friend Hunter: "When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." First, a self disclosure: I'm not by any means a Buk authority, just a hardcore fan (thanks to Ulvis).

Yes, a whole strip of B&W negatives of the 1976 Buk shoot "disappeared" around 1977. I will address this later. (Owoo, that should be worth the price of admission alone).

In the meantime, a few of you may be familiar with the 1994 "Alpha Beat Press" (ISBN: 0-921720-42-4) commemorative chap book printed just prior to Buks funeral, edited by Ana & Dave Christy (blessings to you both). I don't see why this great little edition isn't referenced in the serious "collectors" lists like www.collectingbukowski.com ? Shame on you! It has several great/rare Buk poems, some unpublished from their previous "Alpha Beat Soup" collections.

On the cover of this issue is Ulvis's photo of Buk guzzling a Heineken beer in front of his frig from the photo-shoot in question. On back cover is Ulvis's photo of Buk standing gallantly holding a beer with his right hand behind his back. On the inside pages are two other photos from this session. One is of Buk lifting barbell weights high over his head in front of a now open frig full of nothing but beer (I have a couple of 5x7 prints of this left). The other is of Buk and Ulvis standing together in front of frig. This last image was submitted to Alpha Beat by "Joan Levine" and is properly credited as such. The other three images are credited to "Ulvis Alberts, photographer." As a matter of fact, on the second to last page, there is contact info for Ulvis for anyone interested in purchasing copies of these three prints.

It should be noted that in these photographs it is obvious that some type of supplemental "studio" lighting was used---likely a strobe of some type---placed just left and overhead of camera or bounced off ceiling. This fact will be significant to the Silly Hat jury of courtly jesters later...

So, my Lords of Cosmic Jest, I present before you this evidence as "Exhibit A" Blah, blah. Four photographs taken of Buk in the course of a drunken afternoon by two individuals claiming to be "photographers" and ever since that day having "exclusive" or "joint" copyright to ALL images created. Four photos were submitted to Alpha Beat in 1994, credited to two different individuals (three to one and one to the other). I was with Ulvis in 1994. There were no lawsuits, controversy, arguments, SWAT Teams, between the two parties then. Each claimed, received, published their respective photographs with copyright and without dispute. Problem is---and now we get into the...what's the German phrase for "dark heart" or "delusion of grandeur" ----the real story.

 

[marina del rey]

I don't see why this great little edition isn't referenced in the serious "collectors" lists like www.collectingbukowski.com ? Shame on you!

There's no shame - maybe he just doesn't have access to an image of it. Send him a scan and he'll probably put it up.

 

[chronic]

Yeah, send him a scan and he'll probably put it up. If he doesn't I will personally kick his ass. I have it on good authority that his back is messed up and he's on Vicodin... it should be really easy to take him out.

 

[puravida2u]

there is nothing funny here Geoff except for the lies.

As I previously referenced the lovely 1994 Alpha Beat Chap Buk commermorative publication, I wanted also to mention that included in it is a poem entitled: "Photographing the Poet" by Ulvis. I have several rough drafts of this in my archive. I have had to change the format here from the Alpha published edition. The realtive siginication of this piece is "Exhibit B" in the authenticity of who photoraphed the "Georgia Peckham-Krellner/Georgia Hubbard" image with Buk. I have heard this strory first hand on servral ginned-up occasions, much more colorfully than the following poem. But here it is:

Photographing the Poet---Ulvis Alberts

We were somewhere off Western at Sunset, in a small apartment, we waited for the poet to rise in the early afternoon with our six-packs of XXX Mexican beer.

The poet entered the living room, hung-over, not knowing what it was we wanted. But the beer smoothed over the preliminaries, and we discussed shots in the kitchen"”since it was a photo series on famous people and their refrigerators.

As we talked and drank -Amphetamine Sal- a skinny, hooker entered the front door---as if on cue"”and paced back and forth in the tiny room and shrieked; "I can't believe it... all the way up Western every guy on the block is whistlin' and yelling at me... cars are honking, and stoppin' and the street is going wild. I mean what's going on?"

And we sat on the couch, and the poet in a chair, and smiled in a cautious way at the Sal show. And Sal was pacin', twitchin' and foolin', with her short -wrap-around- leather skirt, pullin' it back back and forth on her hips. And finally, pullin' the slit of it to her rear. The poet said wryly, "Sal, slow down. You just walked through Hollywood with your marble white ass stickin' out for the world to see." We all laughed, and the poet and Sal walked into the kitchen for a portrait. They posed -beers in hand"”by the fridge.

A few years later, the fridge photographs were published in Germany about the time one of the poets novels was translated. The books sold better than ever.

The last I heard, the poet moved out of the dumps of E. Hollywood, bought a BMW, got married, and Hollywood made some movies of his life.

In one of his books, I read a poem about our photography session"”he lamented not fucking my partners ass.

But Hank, the best thing that happened that day---1976----was Sal showing up with her bare ass. And yet that was years before an actress would become famous not wearing panties in a Hollywood movie.



More to come!

 

[james]

Gene,
see post 18 in this thread.

 

[zenguru]

Saw this thread yester after perusing Sounes' bio of Buk. I came across the picture in quesiton while looking through the photo section of the book. It lists copyright for the picture as for Joan Levine Gannij.

I had not realized that Georgia was Pamela 'Cupcakes' Miller's best friend.

 

[bospress.net]

Saw this thread yester after perusing Sounes' bio of Buk. I came across the picture in quesiton while looking through the photo section of the book. It lists copyright for the picture as for Joan Levine Gannij.

well, if Unkel Howee says it is true, then it must be true.

Still, It is interesting. Joan Levine says that she was working on a series of famous people in front of their fridges. Has anyone seen any additional images of other people from her series?

I have seen photo by ULVIS ALBERTS of Alice Cooper in front of his refrigerator.

Curious, I tell you.

Bill

p.s. Then there is always this image of Buk in front of his fridge...

 

[puravida2u]

Re:#40 James, With all due respect, I'm not sure what you're referring to "see post #18.." Are you one who believes Obama was born in Kenya? Please see my very first post #34. Just an oversight or are you asking for something more, DNA test perhaps? Lighten up. I'm trying to tell you the real story here... Oh, I have other pics of celebs in front of their refers from that "project" in my archives, Linda Carter in her Wonder Woman Costume for starters. And just like the the two shots Bill shares above they were ALL created by Ulvis. more later...

ps, the photo of Alice is available from me on eBay right now (puravida2u).

 

[james]

pardon me? i was simply posting a link to joan levine telling her version of that night in buk's kitchen. it's from "the cruelty of loveless love."
i'm not asking for anything more. Obama and DNA? with all due respect, what the hell are you talking about?

 

[marina del rey]

Re:#40 James, With all due respect, I'm not sure what you're referring to "see post #18.."

Maybe you didn't notice that there was a link to a different thread in James' post?

Otherwise, I don't understand the reaction.

 

[chronic]

Yeah... wow. What a reaction. James pointed you to something that completely negates this statement:

She has always given Ulvis Alberts credit and royalties from their partnership with that picture.

She refers to your father as "an assistant."

And you jump on him? I think you owe him an apology.

 

[bospress.net]

Gene,
Yes, I think that he was letting you know about the claims of Levine, which I find insulting to Ulvis To refer to him as an "assistant" and then say that the fridge shots were her project is giving herself WAY too much credit, plus she has nothing to back it up. Where are her fridge shots?. She had one of her relatives post here a while back and repeat these claims of ownership, which I, for one, do not believe.

James was not busting your balls, but letting you know about her odd claims.

Bill

 

[mjp]

Lighten up? Did he really type that? Ha ha. Pot, kettle, etc.

Gene and Geoff are cut from the same hypersensitive and condescending cloth aren't they. Please do not question them. They are only slumming here. Don't you get it it?

What's wrong with you people?

 

[james]

yes, lighten up, everyone!!!

what i don't understand is, if they're not joan's prints (i'm not saying that they are), how did she get "cruelty" published without getting into legal trouble? not that i even care who took the damn photos at this point...

here's another buk and georgia image from the book:

 

[mjp]

not that i even care who took the damn photos at this point...

I'll second that.

 

[puravida2u]

Jesus, ALL I saw in James #18 (6/19/07) post was his reference to the mystery man Geoff not "having introduced himself."
(By the way, where is mama's boy?) I didn't see there was anything else, such as "a link to joan levine telling her version of that night in buk's kitchen."
(would love to see it though). Was I looking at the wrong "post 18?"
So, James, I am truly sorry to have offended you and for the confusion! I will immediately go beat myself soundly across the nose with a wet newspaper. My wry sense of humor doesn't always come across as intended. I wasn't trying to "jump on you."
MJP, I enjoyed your early comedy & pissing on Geoff, as well as the Art of you hand-sewn poetry editions; very fine work!
I don't know shit about forums, how they work, and the only thing I know about threads are the one's my ex left me with. Perhaps I should use little smiley faces in the future? Maybe I'll get "defriended" next! One has to see some irony in being accused of "slumming here?" (#46).
So, we could get back to the story? I think this all started with one mans interest in getting a print of Buk and Georgia (I believe anybody who wants one should be able to get one), a 25 year mystery of "missing" negatives, questionable attributions of copyright, son's of vagabonds, and twists of fate. Maybe nobody cares. Anybody, can put their name on one of your poems, publish it and claim it as theirs (doesn't make it so). If 25 years later it turns out to be historically significant (who would have imagined it back then?) you might feel strongly about it now too? I had hoped by coming forward now, I might be able to enlist some support from the Buk community, drag Levine, et al out into the light and to finally make this right. As I said before, it could be fun?
As for Ulvis, he gave up on this mess 20+ years ago because its generally all you can do just to pay the bills, hang the next exhibition, not worry about the blood in your piss, or the last asshole that screwed you on a photo-deal. Karma happens. So, what say you all?

 

[Mark73]

Huh?

 

[mjp]

Huh?

Exactly.

I wonder if it is possible for you to get to the point (if you have one)? You have typed and typed and said nothing. One line about a possibly distinctive flash pattern. I'm not sure what you're looking for here, or what you are trying to say.

What, by the way, is the "historic significance" of any of Ulvis Alberts' Bukowski photos? There are thousands of pictures of Bukowski, and his don't necessarily stand out as significant. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong - anybody. Not that they are bad, they're fine. Typical. Ordinary. But significant? No.

 

[hank solo]

Gene,
see post 18 in this thread.

The underlined bit was the link. Links are black by default. Here's the link again for anyone who missed it:

https://bukowskiforum.com/threads/the-cruelty-of-loveless-love.226/#post-5614

 

[james]

gene, i still have no idea what you're talking about. you mention my post 18 from 6/19/07? i didn't even join the forum until december 2007. you were somehow looking at the wrong post.
this image is all i was pointing you to. it's from a book. by joan levine. called "the cruelty of loveless love." it contains many pictures "taken" by "her". no one else(so the book claims). about a dozen are from the night in question.


ok, hank solo beat me to it!

 

[Gerard K H Love]

The Georgia Hubbard Bukowski photo is very significant. Maybe not in a historical way but that photo is indicative of the Bukowski persona. (if there is such a thing.)

 

[Bukfan]

It's probably the most well known photo of Bukowski. It's surely one of them...

(it was also the first photo of Buk I saw, together with a few Buk quotes in a German ad for one of his books in the late seventies. It was enough to stir my interest and the rest is history, as they say.)

 

[mjp]

It's probably the most well known photo of Bukowski.

Possibly.

But then again, this image has been viewed 17 million times in the past 12 months, so maybe it is the most well-known image of Bukowski. ;)

I didn't say the Bukowski/Georgia picture is not iconic, it is. It just isn't significant. It's not important in Bukowski's history or to his story. At all.

---

I finally remembered where I had contact with Gene in the past. It was an email some years ago that I think was sent from an eBay auction. I asked him a question about a print or something, and he answered me with a tirade threatening to beat me up if I tried to stop his auction.

I wasn't trying to stop his auction, I was asking a question, but okay. I'll have to find that email. Maybe it will add to the fascinating story here.

 

[Bukfan]

But then again, this image has been viewed 17 million times in the past 12 months, so maybe it is the most well-known image of Bukowski. ;)

I guess I stand corrected - once again! :D

 

[Gerard K H Love]

Georgia Hubbard looks like a floozy barfly. That is significant enough because she is pictured with Bukowski who wrote about characters that we would imagine to look like her.

If you put a picture of old man Fletcher up there 17 million views of him would have occurred.
I do not stand corrected.