John Martin
- Thread starter jordan
- Start date
As some readers already know, but it has not been mentioned so far in this thread, Martin's Black Sparrow Press reclaimed John Fante's legacy from literary obscurity, and his marvelous novels have sold to the tune of thousands upon thousands of dollars and greatly benefited his widow, Joyce.
Some critics don't consider Fante a major novelists, but I do. I recently reread his last novel Dreams of Bunker Hill - dictated to his wife because he was blind from his diabetic complications, - and it was as good a read as I remembered it from my first time years ago. Simply evocative, fresh as a spring flower and glowing with the struggles of youth - I found it marvelously satisfying.
In addition, without the visibility brought to Fante through Martin/Sparrow, Ask the Dust as a movie might never have been produced and it has led to even greater exposure for this previously undervalued and neglected writer, regardless of the merits of the film. (I was moved by it after the film finally got off the ground.)
Fante's legacy was a by-product of the Martin/Bukowski collaboration, but if Martin hadn't thought that Fante's words were worth putting into print, he probably wouldn't have published him regardless of Bukowski's veneration. I score that as two major literary bulls-eyes for Martin.
It's not so much the numerous minor literary talents that may not have made it because Martin felt that they were good enough to be published, but the two righteous literary figures that Martin didn't miss and brought out of the shadows into the light.
Martin could afford to take a chance and invest in these 'lesser' writers because of his Bukowski/Fante profits, and they were other examples of his willingness to gamble in order to give them exposure.
Bukowski gambled on a career in writing and on the horses; Martin gambled on his stable of literary unknowns, and I would guess that the outcome was somehow satisfying to him regardless of how far the relative unknowns fell short of the enormous sales that Bukowski and Fante generated. Through Martin's literary gambles - with his money on the line - I have enjoyed countless hours of satisfying, life-affirming reading.
Good luck to him with whatever he's doing now....
Some critics don't consider Fante a major novelists, but I do. I recently reread his last novel Dreams of Bunker Hill - dictated to his wife because he was blind from his diabetic complications, - and it was as good a read as I remembered it from my first time years ago. Simply evocative, fresh as a spring flower and glowing with the struggles of youth - I found it marvelously satisfying.
In addition, without the visibility brought to Fante through Martin/Sparrow, Ask the Dust as a movie might never have been produced and it has led to even greater exposure for this previously undervalued and neglected writer, regardless of the merits of the film. (I was moved by it after the film finally got off the ground.)
Fante's legacy was a by-product of the Martin/Bukowski collaboration, but if Martin hadn't thought that Fante's words were worth putting into print, he probably wouldn't have published him regardless of Bukowski's veneration. I score that as two major literary bulls-eyes for Martin.
It's not so much the numerous minor literary talents that may not have made it because Martin felt that they were good enough to be published, but the two righteous literary figures that Martin didn't miss and brought out of the shadows into the light.
Martin could afford to take a chance and invest in these 'lesser' writers because of his Bukowski/Fante profits, and they were other examples of his willingness to gamble in order to give them exposure.
Bukowski gambled on a career in writing and on the horses; Martin gambled on his stable of literary unknowns, and I would guess that the outcome was somehow satisfying to him regardless of how far the relative unknowns fell short of the enormous sales that Bukowski and Fante generated. Through Martin's literary gambles - with his money on the line - I have enjoyed countless hours of satisfying, life-affirming reading.
Good luck to him with whatever he's doing now....
planahea
RIP
What do all these writers have in common?
Andrei Codrescu
Theodore Dreiser
Wright Morris
John Wieners
Clayton Eshelman
John Yau
Gerard Malanga
William Everson
Jane Bowles
Gertrude Stein
Ekbert Fass
Charles Reznikoff
John Sanford
Wanda Coleman
Jack Spicer
Charles Olsen
D. H. Lawrence
Wyndham Lewis
Paul Bowles
Joyce Carol Oates
Tom Clark
Robert Creely
Fielding Dawson
Michael McClure
Diane Wakoski
Eve Shelnutt
Sherril Jaffe
Edward Sanders (Anyone remember the rock group the FUGS from the '60s?)
...and as a hint, let's throw two other writers into the group
John Fante
Charles Bukowski
Game, set and match to John Martin and his Black Sparrow Press!
The above list is but a portion of the writers John published over 36 years.
Also, many other writers were put into print for the first time by John.
Andrei Codrescu
Theodore Dreiser
Wright Morris
John Wieners
Clayton Eshelman
John Yau
Gerard Malanga
William Everson
Jane Bowles
Gertrude Stein
Ekbert Fass
Charles Reznikoff
John Sanford
Wanda Coleman
Jack Spicer
Charles Olsen
D. H. Lawrence
Wyndham Lewis
Paul Bowles
Joyce Carol Oates
Tom Clark
Robert Creely
Fielding Dawson
Michael McClure
Diane Wakoski
Eve Shelnutt
Sherril Jaffe
Edward Sanders (Anyone remember the rock group the FUGS from the '60s?)
...and as a hint, let's throw two other writers into the group
John Fante
Charles Bukowski
Game, set and match to John Martin and his Black Sparrow Press!
The above list is but a portion of the writers John published over 36 years.
Also, many other writers were put into print for the first time by John.
Rekrab
Usually wrong.
Uh... no, I don't think so. Why?
Gerard K H Love
Appreciate your friends
Wow! They lost a gross out contest to Frank Zappa at a concert in the '60s.
I wonder if John Martin was a fan of the Fugs?
Nothing new expect the last line.
cirerita
Founding member
It's a very unusual interview with Bukowski as most of the questions are Fante-related. The interviewer was doing some research on Fante at the time and she decided to interview Bukowski on the subject.
planahea,
beautiful list! Would love to have been able to shake your hand on this one.
all the best to you.
Lol...much appreciated, Ponder... It's good to know of your interest in the young people passing through here, perhaps for the first time, who may not have over a thousand posts under their belt or may not know exactly how much you know about Fante's resurgence in popularity through Martin's efforts and the extent that he promoted other writers who are still worth reading... Everyone has a first time... Perhaps I just felt like writing something glowing out of gratitude for Martin, so well understood, of course, that Fante's name isn't mentioned even once in over 31 posts in this particular thread, without a reader having to dig it out of other threads... Someone may pick up on Dreams... and decide to read it now, and they'll know that Fante was blind when he dictated it to his wife Joyce and it still has the freshness of youth like it was written yesterday - an amazing feat for a sick and dying man who was being carved up by his surgeons to prevent gangrene because of his out-of-control diabetes... My post also led to a posting of the complete list of Black Sparrow authors promoted by Martin, and that goes out to the newcomers as well - I'd forgotten how extensive the list was, thanks to planahea, and I got to personally thank him for it - another gain that might benefit others... I think some of you discount someone else's efforts to give a relative newcomer, perhaps groping in the dark somewhere, looking for some light of inspiration found in unsuspected places - the same chance of discovery. I think it's important to remember one's own roots and never take the first time for granted, and I remain grateful to the sacrifices these great writers made to get their words out at great cost to themselves and the chance to express that gratitude in my own words, even at the risk of boring those who've seen and done it all. They didn't just write words - they were real people... Anyway, sorry to have bored you and I thank you for the unexpected chance to further expand on why I felt that Fante's last novel, Dreams From Bunker Hill, is well worth reading, perhaps one of his best. It leaves the wistful impression that he was a master writer who had many more novels in him, even at that late stage in life, but he simply ran out of time. And through the extent of Martin's efforts, he is likely to be read and remembered for a long, long time.
Luck, Poptop.
beautiful list! Would love to have been able to shake your hand on this one.
all the best to you.
Lol...much appreciated, Ponder... It's good to know of your interest in the young people passing through here, perhaps for the first time, who may not have over a thousand posts under their belt or may not know exactly how much you know about Fante's resurgence in popularity through Martin's efforts and the extent that he promoted other writers who are still worth reading... Everyone has a first time... Perhaps I just felt like writing something glowing out of gratitude for Martin, so well understood, of course, that Fante's name isn't mentioned even once in over 31 posts in this particular thread, without a reader having to dig it out of other threads... Someone may pick up on Dreams... and decide to read it now, and they'll know that Fante was blind when he dictated it to his wife Joyce and it still has the freshness of youth like it was written yesterday - an amazing feat for a sick and dying man who was being carved up by his surgeons to prevent gangrene because of his out-of-control diabetes... My post also led to a posting of the complete list of Black Sparrow authors promoted by Martin, and that goes out to the newcomers as well - I'd forgotten how extensive the list was, thanks to planahea, and I got to personally thank him for it - another gain that might benefit others... I think some of you discount someone else's efforts to give a relative newcomer, perhaps groping in the dark somewhere, looking for some light of inspiration found in unsuspected places - the same chance of discovery. I think it's important to remember one's own roots and never take the first time for granted, and I remain grateful to the sacrifices these great writers made to get their words out at great cost to themselves and the chance to express that gratitude in my own words, even at the risk of boring those who've seen and done it all. They didn't just write words - they were real people... Anyway, sorry to have bored you and I thank you for the unexpected chance to further expand on why I felt that Fante's last novel, Dreams From Bunker Hill, is well worth reading, perhaps one of his best. It leaves the wistful impression that he was a master writer who had many more novels in him, even at that late stage in life, but he simply ran out of time. And through the extent of Martin's efforts, he is likely to be read and remembered for a long, long time.
Luck, Poptop.
planahea
RIP
poptop,
You are very welcome. (extending hand)
The BSP author list below is by no means complete or even comprehensive.
I just grew tired of typing names. It could easily have been at least three times as long.
John Fante had his work suppressed and he was blacklisted in Hollywood and in book publishing circles during the Sen. Joe McCarthy and his "Red Scare" era of the 50's or he would have surely found a far better place in the literary sun.
Keep up the good struggle against the polemicists.
Bill
You are very welcome. (extending hand)
The BSP author list below is by no means complete or even comprehensive.
I just grew tired of typing names. It could easily have been at least three times as long.
John Fante had his work suppressed and he was blacklisted in Hollywood and in book publishing circles during the Sen. Joe McCarthy and his "Red Scare" era of the 50's or he would have surely found a far better place in the literary sun.
Keep up the good struggle against the polemicists.
Bill
A pleasure.
I was fascinated to learn that Fante was blacklisted during the bleak days of McCarthyism. I had no idea - terrible. It seems that he had continual bad luck as a novelist and it profoundly affected his success and renown until way later in life. I think that his deferred success may have also led to a profound distrust of people and a bitterness in life. Bukowski was one of the few people that Fante allowed into his inner sanctum.
Apropos of Fante, I wish I could remember where I heard or read why Ask the Dust, published in 1939, wasn't more successful at the time. Fante's answer was something to the effect of... "bad luck... and Hitler!" Still not sure of the details on this, but Fante said something like, the publisher of Hitler's Mein Kampf - the same publisher Fante had - was sued and they had to pay back-royalties to the Führer himself and Fante's publisher went down. More rotten luck. If anyone knows more about this, I'd like to know. I'm beginning to find Fante's life as fascinating as Bukowski's and I'm crazy about some of his novels. There was so much good writing left in him that never came out - the spirit of eternal youth that never died.
Thanks again... and a toast to you.
Sincerely, Haizen
I was fascinated to learn that Fante was blacklisted during the bleak days of McCarthyism. I had no idea - terrible. It seems that he had continual bad luck as a novelist and it profoundly affected his success and renown until way later in life. I think that his deferred success may have also led to a profound distrust of people and a bitterness in life. Bukowski was one of the few people that Fante allowed into his inner sanctum.
Apropos of Fante, I wish I could remember where I heard or read why Ask the Dust, published in 1939, wasn't more successful at the time. Fante's answer was something to the effect of... "bad luck... and Hitler!" Still not sure of the details on this, but Fante said something like, the publisher of Hitler's Mein Kampf - the same publisher Fante had - was sued and they had to pay back-royalties to the Führer himself and Fante's publisher went down. More rotten luck. If anyone knows more about this, I'd like to know. I'm beginning to find Fante's life as fascinating as Bukowski's and I'm crazy about some of his novels. There was so much good writing left in him that never came out - the spirit of eternal youth that never died.
Thanks again... and a toast to you.
Sincerely, Haizen
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I'm always willing to give new members information, links, etc, so don't put words in my mouth.poptop said:
I also appreciate your knowledge on fante, it's just that you give me the impression that you're typing page after page, like you're only talking to yourself.
If people klick on search and type fante, they'll find many threads on Fante and on Fante and BSP and this: https://bukowskiforum.com/showthread.php?t=804&highlight=fante you've started yourself.
By the way, I love Fante's work, I promote him in Europe. Great writer.
Rekrab
Usually wrong.
That sounds very interesting. I'll look for that interview.
Too bad nobody thought to ask Bukowski about Write magazine during an interview. I can't recall anyone asking him details of his other early publications, either, although perhaps someone did.
Dan Fante son of John Fante
Dan Fante has had several books. And although he's not like Bukowski, his writing would be more like if John Fante was raised in NYC in 60's instead LA. Fast ad 'furious.' I had fun reading it.
Dan Fante has had several books. And although he's not like Bukowski, his writing would be more like if John Fante was raised in NYC in 60's instead LA. Fast ad 'furious.' I had fun reading it.
Yeah, I saw it imediatelly after I posted. I am glad to see Buk fans are always on lookout ;-)
I had some minor dealings with Martin back in the late '90s, mainly me bugging him for addresses of many of the BSP writers for my own publication, or asking Buk related questions. He was always helpful, though brief, and I can only imagine how many people like me bugged him throughout the years. We did have a misunderstanding at one point, but it got sorted out.
I think his contribution to contemporary American writing is immeasurable, even if he'd never published Bukowski.
Even his overzealous protection of Bukowski's writing is understandable. And really it's not that unusual for a publisher to maintain a tight lock on a writer's output.
I think his contribution to contemporary American writing is immeasurable, even if he'd never published Bukowski.
Even his overzealous protection of Bukowski's writing is understandable. And really it's not that unusual for a publisher to maintain a tight lock on a writer's output.
Gerard K H Love
Appreciate your friends
Thanks James, I'll read it at home where I can turn the laptop upside down for that last page.( big smile)
Bukfan
"The law is wrong; I am right"
Great article! There's some info I have'nt seen before. Thanks a lot, James!
Funny, Martin says he bought 200 periodicals with Buk poems, dating back to the 1940s - enough poems for a sixth (posthumous) collection. - I always thought the posthumous collections were created from a backlog of unpublished poems Buk had sent him through the years. Hmm...
Funny, Martin says he bought 200 periodicals with Buk poems, dating back to the 1940s - enough poems for a sixth (posthumous) collection. - I always thought the posthumous collections were created from a backlog of unpublished poems Buk had sent him through the years. Hmm...
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LickTheStar
Sad Flower in the Sand
Thanks for the article, I can't wait to get home and read it!
Black Swan
Abord the Yorikke!
great article James.
JM just walked forward, he was truly inspired.
JM just walked forward, he was truly inspired.
Well all the better then! The article, (at time of publication?)-says he's 72. Forgive me please Ponder, I can't print the thing, I'm outa' ink, so I'm skwintching at my very shity computer screen trying to make out dates.
The man and his minions were masters! Thank God for every one of them. My life would be that much more empty if it were not for Charlels Bukowski, and John Martin! CRB:)
The man and his minions were masters! Thank God for every one of them. My life would be that much more empty if it were not for Charlels Bukowski, and John Martin! CRB:)
mjp
Founding member
So you didn't believe me the first 100 times I said that whole "poems set aside for posthumous publication" fairy tale was bullshit? I am hurt. Truly.
I bought a cheap laser (black ink only) printer a while ago.
Made in China of course. The thing goes on forever and ever.
cirerita
Founding member
Ha, ha! You guys are truly something. Let's say that the posthumous collections were taken rather than created from the backlog of unpublished material. Bukowski didn't specifically set aside any poem at all to be published by Martin, either when he was alive or when he was dead. He never knew which poems were going to be printed.
mjp
Founding member
101.
Bukfan
"The law is wrong; I am right"
Ha-ha! I knew that, but I did think the posthumous books were created solely from the backlog of unpublished poems Buk left behind. This article here suggests that some of the poems were taken from old mags, and that's news to me. Did Martin also use poems from old mags for the posthumous books??
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