i dont understand how you found my facebook details.
Women by Charles Bukowski
- Thread starter beerbelly666
- Start date
Bukowski would have hated every one of you bastards. Look at you. Acting like lit snobs, saying that some people just "don't get it" (as if Bukowski's aim was to be clandestine), and being insipid fanboys. He probably would have stopped writing if he'd known that people would treat his work so trivially some day. Grow the fuck up.
you tell 'em, kassandra. they've never heard that one before.
mjp
Founding member
Really, now! Is that how they taught you to talk at the Christian Academy of Indiana? For shame.
Yes. Please help us.
I am an insipid fan boy bastard.
I hate the trivial way we treat his work here.
Please teach me how to write contradictory posts, in a condescending tone, using a few clever college words and some swears thrown in for authenticity... Awesome.
Where's your blog?
I am an insipid fan boy bastard.
I hate the trivial way we treat his work here.
Please teach me how to write contradictory posts, in a condescending tone, using a few clever college words and some swears thrown in for authenticity... Awesome.
Where's your blog?
My insult was hurled directly at the beerbelly666's of this forum (those who have only read a few of his novels and seem not to grasp Buk's character whatsoever), though mjp is behaving rather badly in this thread it seems ;). 'Fanboys' is an appropriate term for anyone resembling the boys in Women who wanted to "reward" buk with a sixpack. Bukowski constantly complained of people talking about writing--particularly his writing--so my comments were neither unwarrented nor pretentious in light of comments like "you just don't GET it, man." Bukowski was straightforward for a reason.
in that case, welcome!
I'm hesitating to enter the fray here, but this is a question that interests me. How does anyone decide a novel, poem, story, play, symphony, painting is OK or good or great? My grandfather used to say de gustibus non est disputandum--you can't argue about taste. You like spinach, I don't, so what are we going to do? Have a fight about whether or why spinach is good?
So switch the question to the arts: you like Beethoven, I like Madonna--what now? Now, one can make arguments about musical complexity, "depth," etc but now we are into questions of "value" and also perhaps knowledge of the history of music. If you know more about music, should your judgment be considered of greater value? If you know nothing about astrophysics, you wouldn't be taken seriously if you start making statements about cosmology.
So I'm divided about this. I think if you know little about literature--or in this case ALL of Bukowski's writing--your ideas about Women may be said to have less power as arguments than someone who does know more about these things.
And finally, why do we care? When we argue about whether one work of art is "better" than another, perhaps we are really arguing about what we value and think is important which connects with questions of "morality," "right and wrong" how we should live our lives, and a bunch of other stuff. This is perhaps why these arguments are more highly charged than whether or not you like spinach. Or we can just forget the whole thing and agree that in the scheme of things, it doesn't matter at all whether you like Beethoven or Madonna, Women or Post Office or Hamlet or Brothers Karamazov or the DaVinci Code.
So switch the question to the arts: you like Beethoven, I like Madonna--what now? Now, one can make arguments about musical complexity, "depth," etc but now we are into questions of "value" and also perhaps knowledge of the history of music. If you know more about music, should your judgment be considered of greater value? If you know nothing about astrophysics, you wouldn't be taken seriously if you start making statements about cosmology.
So I'm divided about this. I think if you know little about literature--or in this case ALL of Bukowski's writing--your ideas about Women may be said to have less power as arguments than someone who does know more about these things.
And finally, why do we care? When we argue about whether one work of art is "better" than another, perhaps we are really arguing about what we value and think is important which connects with questions of "morality," "right and wrong" how we should live our lives, and a bunch of other stuff. This is perhaps why these arguments are more highly charged than whether or not you like spinach. Or we can just forget the whole thing and agree that in the scheme of things, it doesn't matter at all whether you like Beethoven or Madonna, Women or Post Office or Hamlet or Brothers Karamazov or the DaVinci Code.
Black Swan
Abord the Yorikke!
Personally, I like spinach, even if eating it makes the back of your teeth feel funny.:)
Bukfan
"The law is wrong; I am right"
Do you prefer Sauerkraut? :)
I had to google Rauchende Colte. It's Gunsmoke? Heh. I wouldn't mind hearing Festus (one of the greatest TV characters ever) say "you old beady-eyed snaggletoothed polecat" in German. The problem with spinach is the presentation. Canned in vinegar it sucks. Sautéed in butter it is quite a different matter and as a base for salad it's far better than lettuce. And as for David's assertion it doesn't matter what you like in the grand scheme of things I only have to add the only book I ever drop-kicked across a bookstore was a collection of Rod McKuen's poetr...poet...poe...fuckmethisisgodawfulshit. There are limits to what doesn't matter.
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yeah, 'Rauchende Colts' is 'Gunsmoke' and as a child I too liked Festus.
Then there's 'Western von Gestern'
And of course, we do have 'Poppey' and other nice American culture on TV.
Unfortunately we also have 'Hannah Montana', but maybe, I just don't get it.
And I like sauerkraut sometimes, but prefer savoy to my Franconian 'Schäuferle'.
Then there's 'Western von Gestern'
And of course, we do have 'Poppey' and other nice American culture on TV.
Unfortunately we also have 'Hannah Montana', but maybe, I just don't get it.
And I like sauerkraut sometimes, but prefer savoy to my Franconian 'Schäuferle'.
Women arrived today.
I am happy about this.
This is my first time reading Bukowski!!
Finally.
I'll probably finish this in 2 days.
I have 3 more books on order.
I am happy about this.
This is my first time reading Bukowski!!
Finally.
I'll probably finish this in 2 days.
I have 3 more books on order.
hahaha, Stavrogin, thats awesome.
In one night, I've read about 50 pages and I am HOOKED already.
This is amazing.
So upset I didn't discover this man sooner.
Better late than never?
In one night, I've read about 50 pages and I am HOOKED already.
This is amazing.
So upset I didn't discover this man sooner.
Better late than never?
Question:
Chapter 67:
"We're S.R.O".
What does S.R.O. mean?
Thanks!!
Chapter 67:
"We're S.R.O".
What does S.R.O. mean?
Thanks!!
I can't believe I didn't know that!!
I've purchased tickets for hockey games that were standing room only. hahah.
I've purchased tickets for hockey games that were standing room only. hahah.
Another question.
My version of the book is ISBN 978-0-06-117759-0.
It has the Orangeish cover with the lady in heels.
How do I know what edition/print this is?
I've read the inside covers, but, its unclear as I'm completely clueless when it comes to this sort of thing.
Thanks!
My version of the book is ISBN 978-0-06-117759-0.
It has the Orangeish cover with the lady in heels.
How do I know what edition/print this is?
I've read the inside covers, but, its unclear as I'm completely clueless when it comes to this sort of thing.
Thanks!
In case you worry about the 'spoiled/ruined' 1st edition: it sure isn't that one. The text you have is as Bukowski wanted it to be. The ruined one was a BSP (=Black Sparrow Press) and it was only the very first edition of that.
What you have is just a brand new Ecco-print, that does not hold the ruined version. (And will never be a collectible either btw.)
What you have is just a brand new Ecco-print, that does not hold the ruined version. (And will never be a collectible either btw.)
Can you expand on this "ruined" edition?
Thanks.
Thanks.
I know little to nothing about Bukowski.
I'm new to the forum and new to his work! I'm only on my first novel.
I have lots to learn. Its why I'm here!
I'm new to the forum and new to his work! I'm only on my first novel.
I have lots to learn. Its why I'm here!