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Why the Beatles?
- Thread starter Billville
- Start date
I love this cover version of The Fool on the Hill (not to say the original isn't great):
mjp
Founding member
If I'm not mistaken, Fool is the only Beatles recording that none of The Beatles played on.
If I am mistaken, I trust the encyclopedic Beatles mind of Purple Stickpin will correct me.
(I'm reading The Complete Beatles Recording Sessions at the moment, which is the only reason I know/remember that factoid.)
Skygazer
And in the end...
Never heard or read that before, but haven't read the book you refer to, I can't believe it. Ringo is listed as having played the finger cymbals - very important:)
Re Paul on Bass my favourites are pretty obvious ones: Everybody's Got Something to Hide... and Come Together.
http://www.macca-central.com/macca-archives/guitarplayer.htm
I agree, he was the one that got "lumbered" with it. the other two didn't want to be bidesmaid, as it was thought of then. Maybe he helped changed the status and profile of the Bass Guitar. But his all round musical ability is recognised and he did play lead guitar on more than a few (over 30) Beatles tracks, as well as piano and other instruments, so for me Lennon is the singer/songwriter who played guitar, McCartney the musician/songwriter.
Re Paul on Bass my favourites are pretty obvious ones: Everybody's Got Something to Hide... and Come Together.
This is a longish interview gets good about a third of the way down:
http://www.macca-central.com/macca-archives/guitarplayer.htm
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mjp
Founding member
You're right. I just checked and it turns out I was thinking of She's Leaving Home, which is only strings - none of The Beatles played on it.
Yes, but Paul played acoustic on that and the string quartet was added later, so She's Leaving Home is the one - well, except for Revolution 9, of course (edit: well, that's not really a Beatles recording, is it?). There was serious talk of releasing Yesterday as a Paul McCartney record, not a Beatles record, but the "we're all in this together" philosophy prevailed, which may have gone a long way to minimize the hacking off.
There was perpetual hazy smoke in the control room in those days at Abbey Road and many of Lewisohn's assertions in that book have been contradicted by others. It's still a great book. Mine's a first edition (1988) and I believe some edits/corrections were made in subsequent editions.(I'm reading The Complete Beatles Recording Sessions at the moment, which is the only reason I know/remember that factoid.)
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mjp
Founding member
There's a picture of George playing a rightie Jazz Bass during the Abbey Road sessions in the Recording Sessions book. The Beatles Gear mentions (no pictures though) that Fender sent it over to them (along with a lot of other things) and that John and George played it, but ultimately they preferred the Bass VI.
I'm sure they were. If you notice though, there are three different stories for everything that ever happened with them. I think the interesting thing about the Recording Sessions book is that he listened to all of those tapes and read all the studio notes. So stories and recollections aside, a lot of what he's saying in there was written down by the engineers at the time, so it's probably as close to "truth" as anything that was written about The Beatles.
I saw the first edition in book stores in 88 and lusted after it, but it was too expensive for me at the time, because (ironically?) I was making my living solely from the band I was in. In other words, I was perpetually broke.
;)
Apparently Lennon was immune to that philosophy, since he put out Give Peace A Chance with the Plastic Ono Band while he was still a Beatle (but The Ballad of John and Yoko - which sounds more like a Plastic Ono Band song - as The Beatles - go figure).
I remember reading about the righty Jazz in Babiuk's book and that it wasn't a favorite of John and George (presumably because it feels like a bass string-spacing and scale-wise and the Bass VI feels much more like a guitar); I couldn't remember whether they got it at the same time Paul got his lefty or later. Later makes some sense. It's possible that George actually used it during Abbey Road, but I don't hear a Jazz bass sound - like you hear on Glass Onion, Yer Blues, and While My Guitar Gently Weeps: good low end but a good amount of grindy crunch.
As for Lennon's release in '69, the Beatles actually broke up in late '69; the last time the four of them were in each other's presence was the photo shoot at John's Estate from which the photos used for the front and back of The Beatles Again/Hey Jude were taken. They agreed to keep it secret for various financial reasons. So, if there ever was a true sense of "we're in this together," it was gone by late 1969, that's for sure.
mjp
Founding member
I love that book, and it's refreshing to be able to geek out about it with someone other than myself. ;)
Though I did turn Jonathan Nesmith on to it the last time he was here. I was talking to him about his dad hanging out with The Beatles and mentioned the 12 string Gretsch (for everyone else who hasn't read The Beatles Gear book, there's an odd Gretsch 12 string guitar that only George Harrison and Mike Nesmith own[ed]). Nesmith's was stolen and Jonathan mentioned that his dad often talked about the guitar, but since it was long gone he never had a chance to see it. So I whipped out the book so he could look at it. He'd never seen the book and naturally was fascinated by it (he's a musician as well). I practically had to pry it out of his hands.
I wonder who has that Gretsch? Seems like it would be a difficult thing to play anywhere without someone eventually recognizing it, since it's so unique.
That guitar is an odd duck. I owned a Gretsch at one point and I've played a few others, and they are nice players, but that 12-string looks like a clunky dog. I hadn't really read about that one. But I think it's great that you were able to show Mike Nesmith's son a picture of the guitar (more or less) his dad had loved. As for who has it, there's an underground market of stolen art that someone no doubt has paid dearly for and has hanging in an underground bunker or an antechamber deep in the hills of somewhere (such as the 13 pieces of art stolen from the Isabella Stewart Gardner Museum in 1990). It's no more difficult to play that Gretsch 12-string (or, more likely, have in a large collection) than it is to have a stolen Degas, Rembrandt, or Manet hanging over your brandy cabinet. That is, it's extremely difficult; just not any more difficult. :eek:
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my wife taped the grammys last night and showed me as much as i could stomach of ringo starr's "performance".
i love ringo in the proper context but the fact that he's been able to sustain a solo career for 45 years is frightening testament to the awesome power of the "beatle effect".
he's like someone's old but trying to be hip uncle at a wedding doing karaoke.
due to massive respect, i won't comment on macca's appearance, but seeing those cutaways to the audience pretending to love that whatever tune he was doing was embarrassing.
i guess an ego that big is a hard thing to retire but c'mon, man!
i love ringo in the proper context but the fact that he's been able to sustain a solo career for 45 years is frightening testament to the awesome power of the "beatle effect".
he's like someone's old but trying to be hip uncle at a wedding doing karaoke.
due to massive respect, i won't comment on macca's appearance, but seeing those cutaways to the audience pretending to love that whatever tune he was doing was embarrassing.
i guess an ego that big is a hard thing to retire but c'mon, man!
I see Ringo's sick of signing stuff for people to sell on eBay:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7666826.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7666826.stm
Got any comments on the Titanic disaster, Bruno? :aerb:
mjp
Founding member
I remember seeing Ringo's autograph surrender video years ago and wondering why people would still send their shit to him to sign. But then I remembered that there are people who spend their lives chasing pennies on eBay and it all made sense.
I'm sure The Widow©®™ still gets books in the mail for Bukowski to sign. My email inbox reminds me every few days that there are still a lot of people out there who aren't yet aware that he's quite dead.
I would have liked to have seen Bukowski's Ringo video though...
"Yeeeeaaaaah, it's B'kowski. Listen, stop sending me your god damn books. Look at this pile [shaky camera pan to pile of books and envelopes, then pan back]. A man only has so many hours! You're murdering me with these books. I won't sign any more, so stop sending them. Leave me to what's left of my sanity. Okay. It's B'kowski, over and out." [Reaches for the camera, then reconsiders] "And stop friending me on Facebook!"
Right?
;)
I'm sure The Widow©®™ still gets books in the mail for Bukowski to sign. My email inbox reminds me every few days that there are still a lot of people out there who aren't yet aware that he's quite dead.
I would have liked to have seen Bukowski's Ringo video though...
"Yeeeeaaaaah, it's B'kowski. Listen, stop sending me your god damn books. Look at this pile [shaky camera pan to pile of books and envelopes, then pan back]. A man only has so many hours! You're murdering me with these books. I won't sign any more, so stop sending them. Leave me to what's left of my sanity. Okay. It's B'kowski, over and out." [Reaches for the camera, then reconsiders] "And stop friending me on Facebook!"
Right?
;)
Ha! I got linked to that from another article on the BBC website and (not noticing the date) assumed it was fairly recent. You sarcastic so and so. ;)
Skygazer
And in the end...
I've read that. None of the others at that time thought of it as a Beatles song - in 1965. Had it been released as just a McCartney single, you wonder if it would have caused an earlier break up.
I thought that Come Together was the last song they did together in the studio, or was it I Want You (She's so heavy) seem to read different things.
The photo shoot from Tittenhurst Park (John and Yoko's humble abode) are good, but a bit sombre, you just need to add in The Band and you've got the 1849 Californian gold rush all over again.
mjp
Founding member
Depends on what you mean by "together." After they quit touring and became a studio band it would have been unusual for the four of them to record a basic track, do overdubs and finish the track together. Get Back/Let It Be was supposed to be a return to that kind of recording, but of course that ended up being a big mess that they couldn't stop dicking around with, and ultimately none of them really liked it.
The people who worked with them on The Beatles (a.k.a. The White Album) and Abbey Road all seem to tell the same story, and that is they very rarely worked together by that time. George was absent for long periods of time during the recording Sgt. Pepper, so really, the last album they recorded"together" was probably Revolver.
Technically, the last time they were all four in the studio together as The Beatles was to listen to the final mix of Abbey Road in the summer of 1969. Purple Stickpin can probably tell you which song was the last true, all-in-the-same-room-at-the-same-time group effort.
The last track ever worked on by the four of them in the same room was I Want You (She's So Heavy) and the date was 20 August 1969 (they also worked on editing and mastering the whole of Abbey Road). The photoshoot at Tittenhurst Park was just two days later; no doubt they all knew that it was effectively over. George, Paul, and Ringo were all together at Abbey Road for mixing and overdubbing as late as 3-4 January 1970 (For You Blue and Let it Be), and Ringo added live drum overdubs on 1 April 1970 while some orchestral tracks were being recorded. Of course, John was there on his own or with George in 1970 working on tracks such as Instant Karma!, etc.
Then again, mjp makes a good point about the final actual collaborative effort on an entire album from inception to mastering. Revolver would probably be it. A bit ironic in that Revolver was the last album made while still touring. Once they stopped touring to focus on recording, they ceased to really be a band. Perhaps that's not so ironic after all. What makes a band a band? Was Steely Dan in the 1970s a band or were they a group of studio musicians who got together on occasion to write and record material? Nothing disparaging meant here, but I'd argue the latter, clearly. It's only semantics, really.
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Skygazer
And in the end...
I believe you absolutely Stickpin:), thank you. The death of Brian Epstein must have had a big impact on them and their ability to keep it together as a band. In their younger days, John as the oldest (oops Ringo a few months older) was seen as the boss, but at the end none of them really seemed to have the heart to carry on despite Paul trying to organise things.
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mjp
Founding member
Epstein's death was a coincidental occurrence, but it makes an easy "reason" to hang the Beatles break up on to (as does Yoko). I think John didn't have the heart to carry on and he was very much still the leader and that's why they split. McCartney was the one flogging the horse, Lennon was trying to walk away.
At least that's how I interpreted the news when I was 9 years old.
;)
At least that's how I interpreted the news when I was 9 years old.
;)
mjp
Founding member
The latest issue of Guitar Player showed up at the house yesterday, and it has an interview with Babiuk and excerpts from his latest project, Rolling Stones Gear: All the Stones' Instruments from Stage to Studio. I'm not necessarily a Stones fan, but I'll definitely be picking up the book (when the paperback comes out, anyway).
But in the interview they asked him what he was working on, he said a revised edition of Beatles Gear with 300 new pages. To which I can only say, 'wow,' and, 'sign me up!'
Damn straight! The original version is only 256 pages, so a 117% expansion is certainly welcome.
I seem to be getting swept up again in Beatlemania, this time 50 years after I saw them on the Ed Sullivan Show. I listened to "I Feel Fine" on Utube and noticed that the song did not begin with
the sustained low note (is it the low "E" on the guitar?) which gets progressively louder. I assume they added this after their live performances? I always thought this was one of their most inventive
pieces...
the sustained low note (is it the low "E" on the guitar?) which gets progressively louder. I assume they added this after their live performances? I always thought this was one of their most inventive
pieces...
Black Swan
Abord the Yorikke!
quite complex when you listen to the music without the lyrics.
The origin of the "feedback note" was the A string on Paul's Hofner bass. Since Paul isn't on this particular track, what I think you are hearing is sympathetic resonance of John's A string to Paul's original note which you hear opening the full recording (the idea was John's apparently). This actually explains something I've wondered about over the years. The primary characteristic of the note is most definitely guitar, but the origin of the note is clearly bass. It didn't occur to me that the end product was both bass and guitar, but now hearing just the guitar portion of the feedback, clearly starting after the note originated, it seems very likely that John sat near Paul's bass rig and let the note cause vibration of his A string.
To my ear, there are a few parts on this recording. The primary guitar you hear is either George or John on 6-string, but you can also hear the other chording in the background. I would have guessed that this main part was George, but the feedback note is from John's guitar and that sounds like the guitar playing this main part. At 1:11, the brief lead break is George dubbed in on his Rickenbacker 12-string.
Edit: The viddy d gray posted seals it: John's playing the watch your step lick and George is strumming rhythm on this one.
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Skygazer
And in the end...
Me too, even talking about them at work... strange. :)
I think that clip is from the South Bank Show documentary John Lennon's Juke Box in which a good few artists discuss how their work influenced the Beatles.Yet to see the elusive documentary though.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Lennon's_jukebox
mjp
Founding member
It's not strange, it's marketing. ;)
Lewisohn seems to corroborate:
The session tape also reveals another new song, 'I Feel Fine', was being worked out at this time. John strumming its distinctive guitar riff between takes of 'Eight Days a Week'.
And on the feedback:
A Lennon idea of which he was particularly proud, with Paul plucking a single bass string and John getting amplifier feedback from his guitar.